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Core Reflex sight - Better options?

This is a discussion on Core Reflex sight - Better options? within the MP Full Size Pistols forums, part of the Smith & Wesson MP Forum category; Hello guys, Im new here. I recently just purchased and M&P 40 Performance Center (ported). I love the gun, I knew I would because my ...


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Old January 31st, 2015, 12:53 PM   #1
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Core Reflex sight - Better options?

Hello guys,

Im new here.
I recently just purchased and M&P 40 Performance Center (ported).
I love the gun, I knew I would because my brother has the Pro series 40L as well as a Shield .40. Also my dad has the m&p 40c

Anyways, its a great gun. I have been to the range a few times with it and I love how it shoots.

One of the main reasons that I bought it was for the CORE option to mount red-dots. I personally LOVE using iron sights and I am pretty accurate with them, but I like the idea of a reflex dot sight, and I REALLY feel like it will help my wife shoot.

She never wanted anything to do with it, but about a month ago we had an attempted break in at night while she was sleeping home alone (I work midnights). I caught the guy on my home security cameras literally pull out a full size steak knife from his sweatpants pocket and start cutting my screen door. Luckily he never got past the locked screen door, and after trying another door he finally gave up and left. Very scary for me and my wife, especially with her being by herself.

I have since switched to day shift at my work, and also finally got her to go to the range with me and shoot. I would love to mount a nice reflex sight on it, but quite frankly I am disappointed with the few options that we have.


First off, I don't like the Burris FastFire iii because I really want to co-witness the iron sights (Like I said, I like the iron sights. Its important to me)

I also don't like the trijicon RMR because the battery being located on the bottom is just a terrible design IMO. For the price point of the RMR it should have more features.

I read about the Leupold Deltapoint 2 and it seemed PERFECT. It had motion sensing, so when you pick the gun up the sight turns on automatically. That is something that I don't believe the Trijicon RMR has (correct me if im wrong, but for the price of the RMR it should have these higher end features). It had the battery spot on the top of the sight. It would also co-witness the sights. All around it seemed like the best option, until I realized that they discontinued it (even though it wasn't even a year old?)

Then Leupold decided to turn the Deltapoint 2 into the Deltapoint Pro. With all the same nice features except pone thing....... The made it bigger and "stronger", but now it won't co-witness because it is so thick. They have included a rear sight to the actual Deltapoint Pro itself. But I don't like that, you don't have any way of knowing if those new rear sights are the same height as the stock front sights, and if they would even be on target anymore.

Im pretty upset they Leupold took the co-witness capability out from the deltapoint 2. The Deltapoint pro is just too big.



So now im curious? What do you all use?
I really wanted the motion-sense on that the Deltaoint 2 offered. Lets face it, if I ever had to use my gun defensively, having to take extra time to try and turn the sight on is just useless. Especially if you forget to turn it on all together. People panic in survival mode, which is why many people choose to always keep one in the chamber. Because in a survival situation, people forget to even chamber a round sometimes.

I don't like the Trijicon RMR or Deltapoint 1 because the battery being on the bottom of the sight. You have to take the sight off to change the battery, and then you have to re-sight it in.

I can't help but to feel a little disappointed in the few choices that we have. It kind-of makes me feel as though the whole "CORE" feature is almost useless to me.
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Old January 31st, 2015, 06:17 PM   #2
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Hey there. I have an 9L PC ported with a Trijicon RM06. I know you dislike the design of the battery location, yeah that may sway some buyers. The battery should last close to a year. Mine was pretty muched zero's from the factory. It doesn't move (side-to-side) at all when sitting on the mounting plate without screws in. I'm not good enough of a shot at 25 yrds to tell if it's just me or the RMR that is slightly off, probably me. Also, the windage screws are easily accessible to make any minor adjustments. Like you, I bought the gun to use with red dot optics. While it really helps me line up my shot better than irons @ 25yrd, I don't even use it anymore. I tend to shoot 7-15yrd at my local range. So, it just sits on top of my gun while I use the iron sights.

For dark/night time use, I have a Streamlight TLR-1 HL rail mounted flashlight. The RMR red dot can easily be seen with the flashlight on. But so can the iron sights..

Quote:
Originally Posted by neagle392 View Post
It kind-of makes me feel as though the whole "CORE" feature is almost useless to me.
I know what you mean, I almost feel like I would have been happier with a 9L pro with stock fiber optics sights. Don't get me wrong it's a great gun, but it's limited in it's applications. It really shines at the range. I feel it's kinda dangerous to use as a home defence gun with flames coming out of the ports. But it does look bad ass! haha I'm considering changing out the ported barrel for a non ported so it will be safer for home defence.

My point is, before you drop the coin on an RMR, make sure you really want it. They can be expensive. Good luck
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Old January 31st, 2015, 06:57 PM   #3
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I use the dual illuminated Trijicon RMR on my CORE. Mostly love it. Never have to worry about batteries. Fiber optic during the day and tridium at night. With a rail light becomes a fantastic optic. I even use the gun as my EDC without the rail light. Put the light on when it's in the bed stand at night. Then I put on Dawson fiber irons. This combination allows for very rapid acquisition of the RMR dot. Just track the fiber irons to locate the RMR dot.


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Old January 31st, 2015, 07:25 PM   #4
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I got the Burris Fastfire 3, works pretty well, but it doesn't co witness as mentioned. Some of the reasons I liked it, moderate price and the battery door is on the top.
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Old February 1st, 2015, 04:51 AM   #5
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I also just purchased the Core Ported model. I installed a Fastfire II using the supplied S&W base & can co-witness fine.

As far as add-ons, replaced the guide rod with a non-captured steel one in order to switch recoil springs. Installed the larger backstrap for better hold. Have a Springer Precision slide racker coming. Other mods made to mags with Taylor Freelance extensions.
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Old February 1st, 2015, 07:11 AM   #6
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I'm another one with a NO BATTERY version of the Trijicon RM05G rmr on my wifes core and is used for CC duty too . No one can tell you what to buy. You have to figure that out all on your own .

https://www.trijicon.com/na_en/produ...al-Illuminated
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Old February 1st, 2015, 07:24 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hardluk1 View Post
I'm another one with a NO BATTERY version of the Trijicon RM05G rmr on my wifes core and is used for CC duty too . No one can tell you what to buy. You have to figure that out all on your own .

https://www.trijicon.com/na_en/produ...al-Illuminated
Thanks,

I looked at the RM05G and while it seems nice with the dual illumination and no battery. I really wanted a smaller MOA. 9 MOA seems quite large. While it would allow for quick target acquisition, it seems like it wouldn't be a very accurate at any mid range or farther distances. How do you like the 9 MOA? You like the size? Do you ever shoot it at farther distances?
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Old February 1st, 2015, 11:37 AM   #8
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Welcome to the forum!
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Old February 1st, 2015, 12:15 PM   #9
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I think most would agree the trijicon rmr is the most robust option out. The battery being on the bottom is a moot point, IMO, battery changes are needed once a year. Remove a few screws, pop old battery out, insert new, screw it back down, all done. More than likely you won't need to adjust and if you do, a few clicks and usually your there. Not sure what features your looking for, but they probably offer one that has them.

The DP's, from what I've read and heard, can be hit or miss. I actually prefer the field of view with the dp, but the trijicon is just rock solid.

If I was going to go with a core, and a new optic, I'd probably take a chance on the first delta point, since they can usually be found for around $350, significantly less than the rmr


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Old February 1st, 2015, 02:56 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by richiecotite View Post
I think most would agree the trijicon rmr is the most robust option out. The battery being on the bottom is a moot point, IMO, battery changes are needed once a year. Remove a few screws, pop old battery out, insert new, screw it back down, all done. More than likely you won't need to adjust and if you do, a few clicks and usually your there. Not sure what features your looking for, but they probably offer one that has them.

The DP's, from what I've read and heard, can be hit or miss. I actually prefer the field of view with the dp, but the trijicon is just rock solid.

If I was going to go with a core, and a new optic, I'd probably take a chance on the first delta point, since they can usually be found for around $350, significantly less than the rmr


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Mostly because I like the motion activation that the DP and DP pro offer. I haven't seen any information stating that the RMR has motion activation. When my gun is in my safe or my bed holster, I like the idea of grabbing it and the sight Turing on without me searching for the on off button in a frantic situation.

The battery on the bottom isn't a huge deal breaker, as long as the battery life is long. I don't like the idea of having to go to the range and check if it'd still sighted in, every time I have to change the battery. So in that aspect the RMR dual illuminated (no battery) model would be great, but they only seem to offer it in 7-9MOA. And I want a smaller dot like 3.5 or 4 MOA.

I want to pull the trigger on the original DP, but they are sold out and backordered almost everywhere. The few places that do have them have jacked up the price past what I feel like it'd worth ($500 when they were being sold for $299-350 ) Some of these places claiming not to have stock until spring time. So I'm not sure what to do. I don't really want to wait until spring.
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Old February 1st, 2015, 06:41 PM   #11
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Most, if not all RMR's always stay on, and battery life is generally over a year.

My early model rm02 has an 8 moa dot. Keep in mind the dot is 8 inches at 100 yds. I like the larger dot as it seems easier to pickup and still turns in pretty awesome accuracy compared to iron sights (for me personally, ymmv)

One feature I wish mine had is the ability to manually adjust the brightness of the dot. Mine is auto adjust, so if there's not much background light, the dot is almost lost. In a darkroom, with a white light, it's gone.

I originally wanted to wait for the dp2 to come out, since it was scheduled to be about$50 more than the OG DP. But since they killed that, I decided to go with the DP1. Luckily, I found an amazing deal on my current setup, so that's what I'm rocking with.
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Old February 3rd, 2015, 02:13 AM   #12
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neagle One thing some miss with a 9moa dot is that's at 100 yards. At 25 its a 2.25" dot .

I use both fairly larger and smaller. I have a 3" dot on a hunting revolver . That allows me to still shoot 3 to 4" 100 yard groups from a rest but at close range at a fast passing hog ?? Forget it your point shooting as the dot in the 3" range needs to be focused on and that's not good .

I personal had a bit of conflict making a choice of the larger dot as It was new to me and it may not allow for best group size for a seasoned bullseye shooter at first but its very good for us and others that have tried it out to normal defense /fun gun distances .



Most pro speed shooters use between a 6" and 12"moa dot

Conceder the 9moa dot covers no more width on target than a stock thinner .120 CORE iron site does at what ever distance you pick .
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Old February 3rd, 2015, 03:42 PM   #13
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Ok thanks for the help guys.



hardluk1, Thank you for posting that information. I was dead set on a small dot until you posted that. I did some quick research and realized that for my uses a bigger dot would be better.

I decided between either a DP or a RMR RM04 or RM05G,
It is hard to find any of these sights right now. Especially the Leupold Deltapoint, that thing is sold out EVERYWHERE. It seems like they had a good sale $299-350 and couldn't keep up with the demand. Some places estimating March stock times.

So I said screw it and I snatched up a slightly used Delta Point off ebay. $325 winning bid. It should be here later this week or early next week.

I went for the 7.5MOA "Delta" (triangle) dot.
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Old February 4th, 2015, 08:37 AM   #14
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I have the RM04 on both the CORE 40L and CORE 9/4.25in. (EDC), the dot is actually 6.5MOA, but is described as 7MOA. I have played with the 3.25 and 9MOA options, and the RM04 seems to fit the bill for a HD/Range build. Added the TLR-1HD to the .40 and a TLR-3 to the 9mm and WHAMMO, perfect for any situation. We regularly shoot 4 inch clays out at 50 and 100 yards no sweat, sight acquisition is easy and becomes stupid-proof.
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Old February 4th, 2015, 09:26 AM   #15
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You started off saying you wanted to get a red dot sight to assist your wife and help her protect herself and then list all sorts of objections to what's out there because they don't meet YOUR desires. Are you going to use this gun or is your wife?

Also, I presume Leupold enlarged and strengthened the DeltaPoint probably for the reason that so many slide mounted red dots don't last long under the severe stress of cycling with the slide on every shot. I expect the original DeltaPoint didn't hold up well enough. Many of the early Tasco, Doktor, etc. red dots either died a fast death or had to be heavily worked over and "hardened" to have a reasonable life expectency.
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