Make the case for a 9mm as a carry weapon? You judge. - MP-Pistol Forum

Make the case for a 9mm as a carry weapon? You judge.

This is a discussion on Make the case for a 9mm as a carry weapon? You judge. within the MP Reloading forums, part of the Smith & Wesson MP Forum category; The advocates for the 9mm state that the same shooter can put more rounds on target more accurately with the lower recoiling 9mm, vs a ...


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Old March 30th, 2014, 04:06 PM   #1
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Make the case for a 9mm as a carry weapon? You judge.

The advocates for the 9mm state that the same shooter can put more rounds on target more accurately with the lower recoiling 9mm, vs a 40 S&W.

Well I did a VERY good test today. You tell ME which I should carry.

The Test:
My primary carry is a M&P 40FS with TFO's. I carry 180gn standard velocity quality defensive ammo. I also own a Storm Lake 9mm conversion barrel for this gun...

I was practicing my draw times today at the range, with an electronic timer, set to random beep 3-5 seconds after activation. I was shooting my competition 40 Pro, but I had the carry 40 along. After my practice session, I pulled out my carry gun and loaded 10 rounds.

At the buzzer, I drew and put two rounds center of mass, basically a double-tap from 5 yards with my 40FS carry gun. I did this 4 more times, averaging 1.5-1.65 seconds from the buzzer to the second round. My group was the steel plate on the left.

Then... I pulled out the 40 barrel, and replaced it with the 9mm conversion barrel. I loaded up 10 rounds of 9mm in a 9mm mag, and ran the exact same test.

Same shooter, same gun, same trigger, same distance, same recoil spring! Everything was the same except I was shooting 147gn 9mm match ammo.

NOW... 40 Major match ammo is MUCH closer to factory spec defensive ammo than 9mm match ammo. The 9mm Minor ammo recoils quite a bit less than defensive 9mm, and the 40 is pretty damned close to defensive.

The 9mm rounds were shot at the RIGHT plate. The times from buzzer to 2nd round were virtually identical. Not enough time difference to matter.

From the two plates, you can see there is less control with the 40 than with the 9. But BOTH groups are highly effective COM groups!

So the question... Would you take the group on the right (9mm), or the group on the left (40 S&W)?

My mind is made up! Which do you think I chose?

JeffWard
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Old March 30th, 2014, 04:11 PM   #2
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I would do the comparison with defensive carry ammo and decide from there. I peronally like and carry both calibers in addition to 45ACP and 10mm.
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Old March 30th, 2014, 04:30 PM   #3
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I have found the same in my shooting. Of the 9mm and even the 45, the 40 is much harder to control. I actually control the 45 the best, more due to the familiarity of the 1911 platform than anything else. However, I'm starting to carry a 9c more often due to carry and light/laser platform availability. I too find I'm much more accurate with the 9 and 45 than the 40.
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Old March 30th, 2014, 04:38 PM   #4
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My guess - You're sticking w/ the 40.
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Old March 31st, 2014, 01:22 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrnak View Post
My guess - You're sticking w/ the 40.
Ding ding ding... WINNER.

Even though my "groups" open up a tiny bit, the speed is the same, and the incapacitation level of the whole group is just as good. I feel anything within a few inches of the spine from the top of your head to just above your belly button is a highly effective hit.

As long as I'm just as fast, which I am... I might as well make bigger holes!

JeffWard
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Old March 31st, 2014, 02:16 PM   #6
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The only way this test would be valid is if it was a blind test.
Knowing which load you are shooting defeats the purpose. You
seem to already think that the .40 is the better choice so of course
your test will reflect that.
That being said I'm glad YOU are comfortable with your choice as that
is really the only important consideration.
Thanks for sharing your results.
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Old March 31st, 2014, 04:20 PM   #7
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There's some pretty exotic 9mm SD ammo out there that rivals a 40 on gelatin and other tests, like the one the FBI uses.

I don't feel under gunned carrying my M&P 9c or my Shield 9 with Hornady Critical Duty 135 grain +P.
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Old March 31st, 2014, 09:30 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by agksimon View Post
Hornady Critical Duty 135 grain +P.
Meh...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0s8I353H4mo
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Old April 1st, 2014, 02:54 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jasonuscg View Post
It was designed as an either or round for cops for going through windshields. There's no perfect round (yet) for everything.
I guess I better go back to Gold Dot and save the Hornady for really big people and getaway cars.
Thanks for the link.

Last edited by agksimon; April 1st, 2014 at 03:04 AM.
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Old April 1st, 2014, 09:21 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by agksimon View Post
It was designed as an either or round for cops for going through windshields. There's no perfect round (yet) for everything.
I guess I better go back to Gold Dot and save the Hornady for really big people and getaway cars.
Thanks for the link.
Best Choices for Self Defense Ammo
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Old April 4th, 2014, 07:25 AM   #11
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Groo here
The case to be made is,,, Will the SYSTEM aka. gun and ammo do what you want...
I carry a small 9mm BECAUSE it is small, [I don't care for 9mm otherwise]
But my larger guns shoot larger cases. [ Why shoot a 9mm in a fullsize gun????]
I also don't care for hi cap mags, at least in a ccw gun,, thin is in.
The M&P line is one of the few hi cap 45 frame guns I can get my hand around.
" Please make a 10mm!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"
Even my revolvers are sized the same way,
You pay your money , take your choice ...
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Old April 4th, 2014, 09:51 AM   #12
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The test might be biased. Do you usually shoot the 40? How often do you shoot the 9mm versus the 40? I shoot my 9c better than my 5" Pro (both 9mm) at 25 yards, because I am used to the 9c since I have had it longer. I am putting more rounds through the Pro, so we will have to see which one I do better with at 25 yards. I like to go to the outdoor range once in a while and shoot at 25 yards because I developed a wicked flinch years ago and shooting at 25 yards makes me slow down and concentrate on the sight picture more. I also dry fire, but distance shooting seems to help more.
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Old April 4th, 2014, 12:07 PM   #13
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Usually when a position is taken the individual holding that position is not likely to being receptive or open to changing their position. Its the equivalent of spitting into the wind with no good out come. People make decisions/conclusions with or without merit. Its their choice let them live or die with it.
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Old April 4th, 2014, 01:04 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VicDog View Post
The only way this test would be valid is if it was a blind test.
Knowing which load you are shooting defeats the purpose. You
seem to already think that the .40 is the better choice so of course
your test will reflect that.
That being said I'm glad YOU are comfortable with your choice as that
is really the only important consideration.
Thanks for sharing your results.
Trust me, it's QUITE apparent, the difference between 40 and 9. Blind or not, I'd know.

My argument is that in the hands of an experienced shooter (I shoot 300-400 of rounds per month) with no 40-flinch, and with proper trigger and recoil control... the 40 is almost as accurate at speed as the 9mm. Even an experienced shooter will shoot slightly bigger "groups" with a 40, but not so wild as to lose effectiveness.

I've honestly gone back and forth between a 40 and a 9 as the better choice. Yes, I think the 9mm CAN be as effective under many conditions, and I think a 40 can be too abusive for smaller shooters and less experienced shooters. And capacity-wise, 2 more rounds is two more (though I will frequently carry 19+1... in 40. LOL)

It all comes down to the most effective combination of capability (ammo), capacity, and control for the individual shooter. I'm sticking with the 40 for my preference.

JeffWard
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Old April 4th, 2014, 02:06 PM   #15
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It's like comparing redheads to blondes. They're both women and both wonderful! Although I prefer my raven haired Latina. To each his own and I respect anyone's opinion that is educated on the subject... guns or women.
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