Another Shield 9 FTE

mugenr · January 21st, 2013, 10:18 PM

UPDATE:

Ok, so after polishing the chamber and feed ramp I shot about 350 rounds between 2 range sessions with mixed ammo. Anything from low powered hand loads to SD +p ammo. I've had no more FTEs since. I say this issue has been resolved! YAY!

--------------------------------------------------------------

Hey guys,

I know there was at least 1 person on this forum with FTE issues and a few others while searching online. But there wasn't a real solution other than blaming ammo or the shooter. Also when people have sent theirs to S&W, there is no update that I can find on what s&w did to fix the issue or even if any fix was found.

So I've put about 350-400 rounds through my shield since I got it back in December and have had numerous FTEs with all kinds of ammo. Winchester whitebox 115gr, S&B 115gr/124gr, Federal 115gr, Winchester Ranger 147gr, etc...
I've tried 6 different magazines and all of produced FTEs. And just in case the shooter is at fault, I've had other shooters shoot it as well with similar results.

I'm thinking about calling S&W tomorrow, but I would love to avoid sending it to them and waiting a while for them to "fix" the issue. (if it has to be done, it has to be done i guess)
I snapped some pictures of today's range trip where in 50 rounds produced 5 FTEs. Maybe this is as simple as polishing out the chamber?

And this is how the next round sits in the magazine after firing a shot

Also, If I do have to send to back to S&W, do I need put the factory sights back on or am I good to go sending as is with the amerigo sights?

Thanks for the help guys.

KRWeiss · January 22nd, 2013, 08:55 AM

Thanks for those great pictures.

I would suggest polishing the chamber, being careful not to overdo it. The idea is to smooth it out and NOT to make the chamber any bigger.

The M&P Shield has a problem with the design of it's extractor, I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for S&W to address it because so few even notice it. The pivot pin hole is milled too far back on the extractor, allowing a gap where it grabs the casing, and toward the rear of the part where the unsupported blue spring can clearly be seen. There isn't a fix for this yet, hopefully someone like APEX will offer us something for a reasonable price.

The only thing I've come up with so far is installing a solid pivot pin, but that only improves it a tiny bit. My next attempt will involve milling a larger hole and pressing in an offset bushing. They haven't left me much material to work with.

Keeter1911 · January 22nd, 2013, 10:59 AM

I own 3 shields (2 in 9 and one in 40). I have well over a thousand rounds through my first one, probably 5 to 6 hundred through the second one and 300 though the 40. I have not had any FTF's. Might be just a bad gun, or maybe I have just gotten lucky.

FUBAR425 · January 22nd, 2013, 12:46 PM

Thanks for posting those pics. I am having the EXACT same problem with my shield as I posted a couple days ago. I contacted S&W and they said it had to do with the remmington fmj ammo I was using. They said remmington had been outsourcing a lot of their ammo and that they've had a lot of issues with it. They said to try the Winchester white box ammo and see how it goes with that. It's good to know that the white box ammo didn't work either and you still had the same results. If you do decide to send it to S&W, let us know how it turns out!

KRWeiss · January 22nd, 2013, 02:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FUBAR425

I contacted S&W and they said it had to do with the remmington fmj ammo I was using. They said remmington had been outsourcing a lot of their ammo and that they've had a lot of issues with it. They said to try the Winchester white box ammo and see how it goes with that.

It's hard to believe they would tell you that, since a self-defense firearm should function properly with any factory ammo. On occasion it just takes a little work to get it there.

packager · January 22nd, 2013, 03:06 PM

I also had the exact FTE problem along with ejected cases hitting me on the head and arm. I had 4 FTE's within 25 rounds using 147 gr Remmington FMJ. I sent the pistol back to S&W and they replaced the extractor and polished the feed ramp. I have not had an FTE since. Part of the problem is with the STRONG recoil spring. I do not have strong wrists so limp wristing is a problem. I believe this amplified the FTE problem and caused the ejected cases hitting me. Starting to loosen up after 800+ rounds.

mugenr · January 22nd, 2013, 05:48 PM

Well, thanks for the input! I performed a very mild polish of the feed ramp and chamber.

Then took it out. First shot, FTE. and then it happened once every mag for 4 mag changes.
I then bought some Winchester Ranger 124gr. T-Series +P. Ran 2 mags of that through. Not a single problem.
After that, I ran 150 rounds with 3 FTEs, which is A LOT better than my previous rounds. (FTE, roughly 1 ever 10 rounds)

It now seems that anything that's a bit hotter will now not fail to eject anymore, but whimpier (is that even a word?) round will still have some issues. But it seems to be getting better.

Going to do another round of polishing then off to test again later this week. I'll keep the thread updated.
I may also end up ordering a new extractor from S&W as well.

psychprof · January 22nd, 2013, 06:01 PM

After putting several hundred rounds of Federal through my Shield 9, I switched to Remington. The first 75 Remington rounds yielded 4 FTEs. I spoke to the range supervisor who thought it was ammunition related. I have 250 Remington rounds that I will feed to my PX4 Compact. Back to Federal for my Shield 9 now that the ammo shortage has abated.

mugenr · January 22nd, 2013, 07:49 PM

Here's a picture of my polish progress in case anyone wanted to see. Polishing feedramp and chamber. It's a bit tough to get a good picture of the chamber polish.

FUBAR425 · January 23rd, 2013, 10:35 AM

Why is it hard to believe that s&w would say that? I talked to the guy over the phone and that's exactly what he said. Don't know why you would call me a lier...that's what this forum is for isn't it? To discuss each others problems? I'm just trying to find a solution to our problem...

mugenr · January 23rd, 2013, 11:20 AM

I don't think KRWeiss is calling you or anyone a liar. I highly doubt that.
How I read that statement was that he is shocked that S&W would tell its customers that their "self defense" pistol is not reliable enough to eat any factory ammo.

KRWeiss · January 23rd, 2013, 11:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FUBAR425

Why is it hard to believe that s&w would say that?

I already answered that. If what they were telling you was true, then the WWB should have fixed it, right?

Quote:

Don't know why you would call me a lier {sic}...

Not sure where you're going with this, I was suggesting they were blowing smoke up your wazoo, no one even implied that you were being dishonest. Although I must admit, your defensive/combative response gets me thinking maybe somethings up.

FUBAR425 · January 23rd, 2013, 05:22 PM

Lol, oh the beauty of the internet. Obviously, I misread what you really meant by your response to the post. Sorry I came off as an a$$hole, not my intention.

mugenr · January 24th, 2013, 06:51 PM

Alright, I think I got it fixed now. I'll go back to the range next week to confirm one more time before i call it completely fixed.

So I polished the chamber and feed ramp a bit more, not too much more. Cleaned up the gun, then took her too the range. Fired about 150 flawless rounds (knock on wood). I was using ammo I knew caused FTE's at the prior range trip and I also brought along weaker hand loads that work great for my M&P FS in competition type games.

All ammo fed and ejected, what a satisfactory range trip

mugenr · January 30th, 2013, 08:22 PM

Took it out for another range session with 200 flawless rounds. i'd say this is resolved

FUBAR425 · January 31st, 2013, 02:42 PM

Glad that worked out for you! I, on the other hand, have contacted smith and wesson and informed them that I'm still having FTE problems even with winchester white box and federal ammo. I'm kinda bummed that I am sending my gun back to them to fix, but I'm hopeful that they find out what's wrong with it. I will keep you guys updated on what exactly they do fix when I get it back...

FUBAR425 · February 20th, 2013, 07:03 AM

**Update. Got my shield 9mm back from s&w and they replaced the extractor, and the barrel. Hopefully when I hit the range this weekend it will be fixed!!

Bill in Tx · February 20th, 2013, 10:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FUBAR425

**Update. Got my shield 9mm back from s&w and they replaced the extractor, and the barrel. Hopefully when I hit the range this weekend it will be fixed!!

+1

deerdad · February 20th, 2013, 12:28 PM

What are you doing to polish? Something like 800 grit on a dowel or like a jewelers paste ? Please explain. (yeah I've never done it)

Greg

deerdad · February 20th, 2013, 06:59 PM

After finding some posts about it I feel dumb for asking now.
Sounds like it's better to leave it alone.

Greg

January 21st, 2013, 10:18 PM	#1
mugenr Junior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Bellevue, WA Posts: 21	Another Shield 9 FTE - UPDATE: FTE Fixed UPDATE: Ok, so after polishing the chamber and feed ramp I shot about 350 rounds between 2 range sessions with mixed ammo. Anything from low powered hand loads to SD +p ammo. I've had no more FTEs since. I say this issue has been resolved! YAY! -------------------------------------------------------------- Hey guys, I know there was at least 1 person on this forum with FTE issues and a few others while searching online. But there wasn't a real solution other than blaming ammo or the shooter. Also when people have sent theirs to S&W, there is no update that I can find on what s&w did to fix the issue or even if any fix was found. So I've put about 350-400 rounds through my shield since I got it back in December and have had numerous FTEs with all kinds of ammo. Winchester whitebox 115gr, S&B 115gr/124gr, Federal 115gr, Winchester Ranger 147gr, etc... I've tried 6 different magazines and all of produced FTEs. And just in case the shooter is at fault, I've had other shooters shoot it as well with similar results. I'm thinking about calling S&W tomorrow, but I would love to avoid sending it to them and waiting a while for them to "fix" the issue. (if it has to be done, it has to be done i guess) I snapped some pictures of today's range trip where in 50 rounds produced 5 FTEs. Maybe this is as simple as polishing out the chamber? And this is how the next round sits in the magazine after firing a shot Also, If I do have to send to back to S&W, do I need put the factory sights back on or am I good to go sending as is with the amerigo sights? Thanks for the help guys. Last edited by mugenr; January 30th, 2013 at 08:19 PM.

January 22nd, 2013, 08:55 AM	#2
KRWeiss Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Northwest Posts: 6,542	Thanks for those great pictures. I would suggest polishing the chamber, being careful not to overdo it. The idea is to smooth it out and NOT to make the chamber any bigger. The M&P Shield has a problem with the design of it's extractor, I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for S&W to address it because so few even notice it. The pivot pin hole is milled too far back on the extractor, allowing a gap where it grabs the casing, and toward the rear of the part where the unsupported blue spring can clearly be seen. There isn't a fix for this yet, hopefully someone like APEX will offer us something for a reasonable price. The only thing I've come up with so far is installing a solid pivot pin, but that only improves it a tiny bit. My next attempt will involve milling a larger hole and pressing in an offset bushing. They haven't left me much material to work with. Last edited by KRWeiss; January 22nd, 2013 at 08:59 AM.

January 22nd, 2013, 06:01 PM	#8
psychprof Junior Member Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: West Palm Beach, Florida Posts: 6	Shield 9 FTE After putting several hundred rounds of Federal through my Shield 9, I switched to Remington. The first 75 Remington rounds yielded 4 FTEs. I spoke to the range supervisor who thought it was ammunition related. I have 250 Remington rounds that I will feed to my PX4 Compact. Back to Federal for my Shield 9 now that the ammo shortage has abated.

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January 22nd, 2013, 10:59 AM	#3
Keeter1911 Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Bastrop, Texas Posts: 713	I own 3 shields (2 in 9 and one in 40). I have well over a thousand rounds through my first one, probably 5 to 6 hundred through the second one and 300 though the 40. I have not had any FTF's. Might be just a bad gun, or maybe I have just gotten lucky.

January 22nd, 2013, 12:46 PM	#4
FUBAR425 Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2012 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 28	Thanks for posting those pics. I am having the EXACT same problem with my shield as I posted a couple days ago. I contacted S&W and they said it had to do with the remmington fmj ammo I was using. They said remmington had been outsourcing a lot of their ammo and that they've had a lot of issues with it. They said to try the Winchester white box ammo and see how it goes with that. It's good to know that the white box ammo didn't work either and you still had the same results. If you do decide to send it to S&W, let us know how it turns out!

January 22nd, 2013, 03:06 PM	#6
packager Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: Central IL Posts: 1	I also had the exact FTE problem along with ejected cases hitting me on the head and arm. I had 4 FTE's within 25 rounds using 147 gr Remmington FMJ. I sent the pistol back to S&W and they replaced the extractor and polished the feed ramp. I have not had an FTE since. Part of the problem is with the STRONG recoil spring. I do not have strong wrists so limp wristing is a problem. I believe this amplified the FTE problem and caused the ejected cases hitting me. Starting to loosen up after 800+ rounds.

January 22nd, 2013, 05:48 PM	#7
mugenr Junior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Bellevue, WA Posts: 21	Well, thanks for the input! I performed a very mild polish of the feed ramp and chamber. Then took it out. First shot, FTE. and then it happened once every mag for 4 mag changes. I then bought some Winchester Ranger 124gr. T-Series +P. Ran 2 mags of that through. Not a single problem. After that, I ran 150 rounds with 3 FTEs, which is A LOT better than my previous rounds. (FTE, roughly 1 ever 10 rounds) It now seems that anything that's a bit hotter will now not fail to eject anymore, but whimpier (is that even a word?) round will still have some issues. But it seems to be getting better. Going to do another round of polishing then off to test again later this week. I'll keep the thread updated. I may also end up ordering a new extractor from S&W as well.

January 22nd, 2013, 07:49 PM	#9
mugenr Junior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Bellevue, WA Posts: 21	Here's a picture of my polish progress in case anyone wanted to see. Polishing feedramp and chamber. It's a bit tough to get a good picture of the chamber polish.

January 23rd, 2013, 10:35 AM	#10
FUBAR425 Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2012 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 28	Why is it hard to believe that s&w would say that? I talked to the guy over the phone and that's exactly what he said. Don't know why you would call me a lier...that's what this forum is for isn't it? To discuss each others problems? I'm just trying to find a solution to our problem...

January 23rd, 2013, 11:20 AM	#11
mugenr Junior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Bellevue, WA Posts: 21	I don't think KRWeiss is calling you or anyone a liar. I highly doubt that. How I read that statement was that he is shocked that S&W would tell its customers that their "self defense" pistol is not reliable enough to eat any factory ammo.

January 23rd, 2013, 05:22 PM	#13
FUBAR425 Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2012 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 28	Lol, oh the beauty of the internet. Obviously, I misread what you really meant by your response to the post. Sorry I came off as an a$$hole, not my intention.

January 24th, 2013, 06:51 PM	#14
mugenr Junior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Bellevue, WA Posts: 21	Alright, I think I got it fixed now. I'll go back to the range next week to confirm one more time before i call it completely fixed. So I polished the chamber and feed ramp a bit more, not too much more. Cleaned up the gun, then took her too the range. Fired about 150 flawless rounds (knock on wood). I was using ammo I knew caused FTE's at the prior range trip and I also brought along weaker hand loads that work great for my M&P FS in competition type games. All ammo fed and ejected, what a satisfactory range trip

January 30th, 2013, 08:22 PM	#15
mugenr Junior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Bellevue, WA Posts: 21	Took it out for another range session with 200 flawless rounds. i'd say this is resolved

January 31st, 2013, 02:42 PM	#16
FUBAR425 Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2012 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 28	Glad that worked out for you! I, on the other hand, have contacted smith and wesson and informed them that I'm still having FTE problems even with winchester white box and federal ammo. I'm kinda bummed that I am sending my gun back to them to fix, but I'm hopeful that they find out what's wrong with it. I will keep you guys updated on what exactly they do fix when I get it back...

February 20th, 2013, 07:03 AM	#17
FUBAR425 Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2012 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 28	**Update. Got my shield 9mm back from s&w and they replaced the extractor, and the barrel. Hopefully when I hit the range this weekend it will be fixed!!

February 20th, 2013, 12:28 PM	#19
deerdad Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 6	What are you doing to polish? Something like 800 grit on a dowel or like a jewelers paste ? Please explain. (yeah I've never done it) Greg

February 20th, 2013, 06:59 PM	#20
deerdad Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 6	After finding some posts about it I feel dumb for asking now. Sounds like it's better to leave it alone. Greg